12.56.56 # <Merko> This discussion certainly gave me a new perspective on some people..
12.59.44 # <Rocambole> Do you blieve that ppl who's getting a cracked piece of software will buy the original afterwards?
12.59.58 # <Rocambole> blieve=belive
13.00.48 # <Merko> I know I did.
13.01.00 # <Merko> So, it's certainly possible.
13.01.10 # <Rocambole> I belive very few are doing it
13.01.26 # <Merko> Why?
13.02.18 # <Merko> Out of people I've been talking to, it seems most people buy software that they have only used pirate copies of.. but I guess the people I'm talking to aren't representative.
13.02.28 # <Merko> only->already
13.02.45 # <Rocambole> I recently talked with a guy who enetered here with a fake AmIRC key. I asked why he used that and he answered that everybody used the faked key
13.03.15 # <Merko> Sure.. I guess that guy never bought any software at all.
13.04.42 # <Rocambole> I have a feeling that only about 5 % of ppl who have used a cracked piece of software buys the original afterwards
13.05.16 # <Rocambole> and maybe the percentage is even lower
13.06.18 # <Merko> What does that "feeling" come from?
13.06.32 # <Merko> I mean, finding pirate copies is not difficult..
13.07.01 # <Rocambole> I have been ircing for quite a few years now and have talked with lots of ppl
13.07.10 # <Merko> And if you intend to buy a product and don't have any problems with the moral issues, why not get the pirate version first..
13.07.46 # <Merko> Rocambole: Well, but have you been discussing with the people using pirated programs, or the people using bought programs?
13.07.57 # <Rocambole> because that keeps the pirates alive
13.08.11 # <Merko> Rocambole: I said, if you don't have any moral considerations.
13.08.29 # <Rocambole> I have been discussing with ppl who used pireted progs
13.08.43 # <Rocambole> pirated
13.08.53 # <Merko> Rocambole: Alright.. but then many or most of them probably never buys any software at all..
13.09.11 # <Merko> Rocambole: The interesting thing is, who is actually buying software?
13.09.34 # <Rocambole> I have regged all shareware prods that I use, and have bought all the comercials I use
13.09.41 # <Merko> Rocambole: Same here.
13.11.07 # <Merko> But I think, most people buying software over here also have pirated software.
13.11.08 # <Rocambole> I belive in buying progs not stealing ;)
13.11.27 # <Merko> I believe in buying programs, not in not pirating programs. ;D
13.11.41 # <Rocambole> the great advantage of buying is that you get the manuals :)
13.11.58 # <Merko> Because, it doesn't help if we get a zillion of people not pirating Amiga programs..
13.12.41 # <Merko> Hehe.. I've registered things like HippoPlayer.. even though all you get is a keyfile that displays your name when starting it. :)
13.12.50 # <Rocambole> I just wonder why the pirates don't use their skills to make their own progs
13.13.00 # <Merko> HiP was incredibly cheap though, I seem to remember.
13.13.05 # <Merko> Rocambole: Many of them do..
13.13.29 # <Merko> Rocambole: But of course, it takes a lot more effort to do a program or a game, or even a demo, or even a small utility.
13.14.41 # <Rocambole> it does, but it should make them feel much better and get them MUCH more credit than stealing others progs
13.15.18 # <Rocambole> a thief is a thief is a thief
13.17.06 # <Merko> Well.. maybe they are doing it for their personal pleasure out of solving a difficult problem, not to gain fame.. I don't know.
13.17.59 # <Merko> I'm thinking of becoming a cracker though. This T3d-dongle is annoying me. Not that I ever use a joystick at the moment, but still.
13.18.16 # <Rocambole> the pleasure would be ten times bigger if they made their own progs solving the probs of making it
13.20.59 # <Merko> Yeah, but 95% of application coding is trivial..
13.21.25 # <Merko> It's just too booooring.
13.21.25 # <Rocambole> and about Dave Haynie, I understand his feeling very well
13.21.27 # <Merko> I understand him, but I think he's kind of dense in that respect.
13.22.03 # <Rocambole> because he hit you?
13.22.05 # <Rocambole> ;)
13.22.07 # <Merko> I mean, attacking someone who in a perhaps distant past used to be a pirate..
13.22.20 # <Merko> It's just not sensible.
13.22.44 # <Merko> No, I don't really care what he's saying.. all americans are strange anyway. ;D
13.22.58 # <Merko> Oops, this channel is logged, isn't it? ;D
13.23.19 # <Merko> ROTFLMAO =D
13.23.23 # <Rocambole> you was the target of all pirates in that posting
13.23.56 # <Merko> Rocambole: I know. But he didn't care in the least if I pirated a few games ten years ago or if I ran a CD duplication plant..
13.25.03 # <Rocambole> just remember that he has suffered of piracy
13.25.17 # <Rocambole> of=from
13.25.30 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
13.26.10 # <Merko> Well, at least the version of DiskSalv4 *I* have is legal.
13.26.41 # <Rocambole> mine to, I bought it and have the original disk here
13.28.42 Mode "#Team*AMiGA +o Jamesc " by services.beyondirc.org ()
13.28.47 # <Rocambole> Merko: did you read Holger Kruse's posting?
13.28.56 # <Rocambole> Good morning Jamesc
13.29.03 # <Merko> Rocambole: You mean the one Mario reposted?
13.29.20 # <Rocambole> Merko: yes
13.29.20 # <Merko> Rocambole: Sure.
13.29.55 # <StG^sNTx> back 2morrow..
13.29.55 Quit StG^sNTx (:| I'll be back! Visit http://home.sol.no/~stgenius/ Always updated with amiga news and usefull info!)
13.29.57 # <Merko> Rocambole: I wonder if it's all true.. a normal cracker organisation wouldn't blackmail.. but I trust Holger.
13.30.33 # <Rocambole> Merko: well, I think that posting is telling the story of developers abanding Amiga
13.30.42 # <Rocambole> abandoning even
13.31.36 # <Merko> Rocambole: Well, if they had sold well, they wouldn't have abandoned the Amiga. THAT is the problem..
13.32.00 # <Rocambole> they didn't sell well because of cracked progs
13.32.25 # <Merko> And what worries me, is that most of these anti-pirate actions will also scare away buyers, I fear more than they will attract buyers.. so I'm kind of pessimistic. :(
13.32.43 # <Merko> Rocambole: No, they didn't sell well because of not enough buyers.
13.33.49 # <Rocambole> Merko: there have been way to many thinking, what the heck shall I buy the prog when I can get the cracked for free or allmost free
13.35.08 # <Merko> Rocambole: Yes, but the solution is to show them why, not to shout at those persons or make it harder to use the programs legally through dongles and weird serial number reports over the net.
13.36.11 # <Merko> I think users will always have the choice between legal and illegal software. And chosing the legal way must offer advantages, not disadvantages.
13.36.18 # <Jamesc> Morning all
13.36.52 # <Merko> (I'm not a friend of religious moralising either.. even if it worked, which I think it doesn't, I think it's far more immoral than piracy even..)
13.37.26 # <Rocambole> latest prog I have buyed is turbo print professional ver 6.02 ;)
13.38.52 # <Merko> Last thing I bought was MUI.. but I'm thinking of buying ImageFX now, it kinda rules. :) And NovaDesign are being optimistic too, not just whining about piracy like some others..
13.39.55 # <Merko> I mean, even if piracy is bad.. I just can't trust a company blaming everything on piracy. They DO have the possibility to affect sales themselves. Complaining about piracy is justified, but it can be too much..
13.41.41 # <Rocambole> many companies who abandoned Amiga claimed low sales as reason
13.43.35 # <Rocambole> but they didn't talk about why the sales went down
13.44.46 # <Merko> Yeah.. sure, a lot of very good programs have also been forced out because of low sales, but in many cases quality is the real reason imho.
13.45.53 # <Merko> For games, I imagine some have actually been killed by piracy quite literally.. if the pirate version gets widely spread very quickly, I think it can affect the sales in a big way, compared to a more "normal" piracy situation.
13.46.35 # <Rocambole> well, anyway I have to leave now
13.46.43 # * Rocambole is heading for bed now. Have a good night and the sweetest dreams all of you. Bye
16.08.58 # <defacto> Right!, I've heard something which I would like if is true or not,
16.09.08 # <Arvid> heh
16.09.24 # <Yoshi> defacto: go on... :)
16.09.45 # <defacto> My friend says he has a Amiga Emulator Called 'Fellow' that apparently runs FASTER than 030/50mhz on his P2 400
16.09.57 # <Yoshi> BS.
16.10.04 # <defacto> He was running Nexus7 on it>
16.10.15 # <defacto> Yeah thats what I thougt Yoshi!
16.10.27 # <defacto> Have you heard of Fellow?
16.10.35 # <Yoshi> defacto: On benchmarks, perhaps. On some games/programs, perhaps. But surely not faster than a 030/50 in every aspect.
16.11.42 # <defacto> He done a AIBB and Sysinfo test they showed faster results than a 030?, I dunno he maybe lying but he apparently Bought the emualtor from HMV stores in London and it contained a rom image of 2.04
16.11.45 # <Yoshi> defacto: I heard of Fellow, yes. Never used it though. Used WinUAE once. On a P120 it crawled like hell, worse than an A500.
16.11.57 # <Arvid> <-- knows only one fellow who runs 'fellow' and he says it is roughly the same speed as his A500. He runs 'fellow' on a Pentium 200
16.12.43 # <defacto> But whatta the 2.04 rom being included on the CD surely that is copyright to AmigaInc?
16.12.43 # <Yoshi> defacto: The only legal disribution of OS2.04 comes with Cloanto's Amiga Forever, and I don't think that HMV sell these...
16.12.46 # <Yoshi> hi Suz
16.12.54 # <Suz> Yoshi
16.13.20 # <defacto> Yoshi: Either HMV or Virgin Megastore, One of the Compliations CD's with Emulators?
16.13.29 # <Yoshi> defacto: Cloanto have a distribution license for any OS up to 3.0 on the Amiga Forever CD.
16.13.58 # <defacto> Yoshi: Yeah thats what I was thinking.... only cloanto
16.14.26 # <Yoshi> defacto: Unless somebody pirated it, but I doubt that such CD's would be sold at HMV...
16.14.30 # <defacto> Oh yeah another thing!!!!!, has anyone heard about this new DSP soundcard for ALL amigas!, its plugs into the diskdrive port!
16.14.44 # <defacto> Decodes MP1-MP3 in hardware!
16.14.51 # <Suz> defacto: Who's making that then?
16.14.53 # <Yoshi> defacto: The Prelude A1200 plugs into the realtime-clock port.
16.14.59 # <Arvid> defacto: read the specs ... looks interesting ... but afaik it is not available yet
16.15.21 # <Yoshi> defacto: Are you sure it's the disk drive port?
16.15.26 # <defacto> Blittersoft in the UK have on the website, they getting ready to sell it!
16.15.50 # <Arvid> Yoshi: it is announced by the people who designed the CatWeasel
16.16.02 # <defacto> Yoshi: Yep goto http://www.blittersoft.com from there follow the links and goto individual computers its called Atlantis
16.16.13 # <Yoshi> defacto: Decoding MP3's in realtime is not that difficult, an 060 can easily manage that... (even my 040/40 can do it (100% load :(
16.16.45 # <defacto> Also and New 'FLASH' rom switcher!, saves ks into flash ram
16.17.43 # <defacto> And OH YEAH PARZIP! USE PARALLEL devices on your Amiga!, sorry all this h/w is getting to me :)
16.18.25 # <Yoshi> defacto: parallel Zip? a Zip is already outdated, and using it through the Amiga's slow parallel port makes it even less attractive (at least to me :)
16.19.36 # <defacto> Yoshi: True! but they've done what they said couldn't be done!, parallel zip/cd roms on amiga, using ONE parallel port (ok so its does use a joystick port as well!)
16.20.24 # <Yoshi> defacto: I'm sick of people doing things just to prove it "can be done"... :-/
16.20.54 # <Yoshi> defacto: Just imitating is not very innovative... especially when you're imitating something that is considered as "bad" my most serious users...
16.22.11 # <defacto> Yoshi: Yeah, true, 'inovate not imitate' , but allows use of cheapo h/w
16.22.45 # <defacto> back in a sec......
16.22.47 Quit defacto (:Bye Bye!............)
16.23.04 # <Yoshi> defacto: Yes, a parallel Zip is cheap, but then again it's slow and 100 MB isn't that much, too...
16.23.35 # <Yoshi> defacto: Yes, a parallel Zip is cheap, but then again it's slow and 100 MB isn't that much, too...
16.24.06 # <Yoshi> sorry for repeating the line...
16.24.46 # <defacto> Yoshi: Yeah I agree with you too, but it makes it easy for me to exchange data at uni with with a parallel zip
16.25.06 # <Yoshi> defacto: Yep, for that purpose it's the best solution...
16.25.39 # <defacto> Yoshi: Anyway.... I quite looking forward to all these new soundcards coming out on the A1200
16.26.29 # <Yoshi> defacto: I don't need much sound... the only time I use it is for listening to MP3's before burning them and putting them in my CD changer in the hifi :)
16.27.05 # <defacto> Yoshi: Hehehehe, thinking about buying a 'PowerFlyer' with CD-R kit myself
16.27.14 # <Yoshi> PowerFlyer?
16.27.25 # <defacto> Yoshi: Yeah can you copy PSX cd's on any CD-R?
16.27.49 # <Yoshi> defacto: Didn't try yet. What's a PowerFlyer?
16.28.27 # <defacto> Yoshi: Yeah PowerFlyer, Another new piece of h/w Plugs into A1200 rom sockets and over 'GAYLE' and completely replaces your IDE port to EIDE upto 16.6 meg sec xfer in pio4
16.28.57 # <defacto> I've seen in use myself at GOLDEN Images warehouse
16.29.14 # <Yoshi> defacto: OK. They should chose less confusing names. When I hear Flyer, I think Toaster.
16.29.31 # <Yoshi> defacto: I'm at 10 MB max. (Fast-SCSI)
16.29.38 # <defacto> A bog standard 3 1/2" IDE doing 5meg /s on A1200 with 030/40mhz
16.30.17 # <defacto> Apparently pio4 mode supports upto 16.6meg/sec when used with 060 and fast ram
16.30.28 # <Yoshi> defacto: My 2.5" IDE only did 700 k/s... Now I'm at >2MB on the A3000 (old 1 GB drives)
16.30.51 # <Yoshi> defacto: Anyway, I often hear that IDE CDR's are less reliable than SCSI ones...
16.30.55 # <defacto> Yoshi: Yeah my crappy conner only 1.2meg/s
16.31.28 # <defacto> Yoshi: Apparently they've done a test when writing to a ATAPi CD-R and surfing at the same time, no data corruption
16.31.33 # <defacto> dunno tho'
16.31.33 # <Yoshi> Anyway, I think I'll be signing off now. Need to get some sleep...
16.31.45 # <defacto> Yoshi: Ok then catch you later....
16.31.46 # <Suz> cya yoshi
16.31.59 # <Yoshi> I heard from a friend (IDE burner on a PC) that he's getting buffer underruns at 2x speed...
16.32.02 # * Yoshi is signing off. See you all later.
16.32.20 Part Yoshi
16.32.49 # <defacto> Oh well I guess I'll hit the sack too... see ya all!
16.32.56 Part defacto
16.33.46 # <Suz> I'm off as well. Laters all ,wave>
20.16.58 # <Kinners> Just thought I'd drop in, butm seeing as it's quieter than outer space, I think I'll leave :) see you laster
20.16.59 Quit Kinners (:I'm off to see the wizard)
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